What if? game.

sarinnesarinne Member
edited February 2014 in Thoroughbred Breeding
Looking through all the new foal pics and reading the bookings for mares this year, a thought occurred to me. What if you were like the Mosses or Mandy Pope and were able to afford first class mares and breed them to the stallion of your choice? We've gone over this with Zenyatta, but how about some of the other girls? A healthy, healed Rachel Alexandra? Havre De Grace? Plum Pretty? Groupie Doll? Goldikova? Black Caviar? Take Charge Lady? Mizdirection? Rags To Riches? Even a retired Eblouissante? Or a younger Mama V or Serena's Song (or any retired blue hen)? Feel free to add to the list, these are just some that popped off the top of my head. I thought it might be a fun discussion.


  • Sounds like fun, sainne. I've often thought about who I would breed to if I owned some of these great mares. After looking at Kurt's Ky. pictures I know Giant's Causeway would be a stud I would definitely use. I'll just have to give some thought to my brood mare barn. : /
  • After seeing Coz and Z13 I really like the Bernardini/Street Cry cross and the Tapit/ Street Cry cross. Also I think the Tapit/Kitten's Joy cross would be a really nice one.
  • Paniolo_GalPaniolo_Gal Member
    edited February 2014
    I think on the genetics thread (page 5), QueenZFan20 and I discovered that we can get a good hypothetical foal out of a Tapit filly-Careless Jewel with Kitten's Joy.

    Here's Careless Jewel's pedigree:
    Here's the hypothetical foal pedigree NO inbreeding back 5x and A++ rating!
    http://www.truenicks.com/free-reports/hypothetical-mating/display?stallionReferenceNumber=6252387&mareReferenceNumber=7709953&mareName=Careless Jewel

    Oh No! RebornRuffian12 just posted an article about Careless Jewel's foaling incident...so sad. I hope Careless Jewel can recover from this terrible foaling where the foal had to be put down due to a broken femur while being born.
  • VA_in_CAVA_in_CA Member
    edited February 2014
    Yes, I hope Careless Jewel survives to foal again, hopefully without incident next time. Someone should have reached inside and pushed the foal's leg back into the proper position. Maybe they didn't have a good strong vet there to do it. Maybe difficult to do as well. Foal could have been too far into the canal. So sad.

    I probably shouldn't be second guessing about the situation. I just wish my suggestion could have been done. Probably couldn't, or maybe it wasn't feasible. Not meaning any offense to anyone. Just wishful dreaming.
  • if she does breed again she should go back to Bode, i was so looking forward to this foal and to find out it was a little boy :( triple whammy on this news :(
  • if she does breed again she should go back to Bode, i was so looking forward to this foal and to find out it was a little boy :( triple whammy on this news :(
    After Bode i vote for Kitten's Joy!
  • Off the top of my head, and if anything was possible with my mares, I'd breed Goldikova to I'll Have Another, or Malibu Moon. Have to think about the others. Zenyatta to Galileo. This is all hypothetical so no need to true nick, or enter into long discussions about genetics. This is pure fantasy. Plum Pretty to Kitten's Joy. Havre de Grace to Paynter.
  • Paniolo_GalPaniolo_Gal Member
    edited February 2014
    I would take a risk and breed my mares to Orientate...he's a 1998 stallion with only a $5000 stud fee. Stud fee and sire recognition would not be my concern...I prefer to avoid inbreeding to the usual Northern Dancer line and breed a good mare to an out cross stallion instead...and keep the foals rather than trying to sell them at auction. Oh..and I would probably have each foal tested for the type of speed gene it inherited so I could gear his/her training to their potential. And if by chance the offspring did not suit racing...keep them for an alternative career like show jumping or dressage, etc.

    This is Orientate's pedigree:

    This is the hypothetical foal for Orientate x Teddy's Promise (A++ no inbreeding 5x)
    http://www.truenicks.com/free-reports/hypothetical-mating/display?stallionReferenceNumber=4480864&mareReferenceNumber=8334259&mareName=Teddys Promise

    This is the hypothetical foal for Orientate x Eblouissante (B+ with no inbreeding in 5x):

    Or...Orientate x Groupie Doll (A+ with some inbreeding to Best Turn & Best Turn's sire/dam: Turn-to & Sweet Clementine):
    http://www.truenicks.com/free-reports/hypothetical-mating/display?stallionReferenceNumber=4480864&mareReferenceNumber=8314539&mareName=Groupie Doll

    Orientate x Havre de Grace ain't too bad either (B with inbreeding to Blushing Groom 3S x 5D):
    http://www.truenicks.com/free-reports/hypothetical-mating/display?stallionReferenceNumber=4480864&mareReferenceNumber=8069196&mareName=Havre de Grace

    Here is Orientate x Authenticity (B+ with inbreeding to Dr. Fager on 4Dx5D):
  • Since in my fantasy I have won the lottery and have unlimited funds, I'd go with a proven broodmare such as Mining My Own or My White Corvette. If I am also allowed a magic wand or a few resurrection spells, I'll take Serena's Song a little younger than she is now, Personal Ensign, Dahlia, and Miesque. Oh, and La Troienne. And Somethngroyal, Weekend Surprise, and Mahubah.
  • And then there Take Charge Lady, dam of Will Take Charge and Take Charge Indy. She's a proven mom of quality. Don't know who I'd breed her to tho. Haven't done any pedigree research on her or the stud muffins I like, but maybe Tiznow? Cool horse.
  • carolinarkansascarolinarkansas hot springs, arkansasMember
    edited February 2014
    i am way out of the box on this....but I would get Take Charge Lady, Oatsee, and Lisa Danielle.....then one year we would find Scrimshaw...a grandson of Sham now in tx I think...and the following year we would go to Wyoming and find Genuine Reward...son of Genuine Risk...but that's the stuff of dreams
  • This is exactly the kind of discussion I was hoping to start -- love reading your responses! And thanks for adding additional girls, and please continue to do so. It might involve a huge dream or magic wand, but that is the point of the post. :-)
  • Here's a fantasy - I'd breed Ruffian to Buckpasser. Or maybe Sunday Silence. Maybe I'd save Sunday for the following year with Ruffian.Third year for Ruffian, a date with Dr. Fager, and then I'd sit down and watch the fireworks when that foal hit the track. Ruffian never got the chance to have a foal, so I'd want her to have plenty. And in my dream, Cigar will be fertile, and so I'd eventually send Ruffian to him. It would be interesting to see what color foal would emerge from a Sunday Silence-Ruffian pairing. Of course, she'd have to go to Man 'O War, and Secretariat eventually, and let's not leave Citation out of the mix. Citation's jock, Eddie Arcaro, said of him: "He's the runningest Son of a Bitch I've ever been on". I think I'd like Ruffian to have him.
  • Regret, Lady's Secret, and Terlingua. Two out of three Secretariat's girls. I need to think about who I'd like to see them matched up with....... Terlingua with Big Brown, Lady's Secret with John Henry, and in my fantasy, he's not a gelding, Regret with Man O'War.
  • Two ladies who died too young - Pine Island, and Eight Belles. Pine Island with Native Dancer, Eight Belles with Smarty Jones.
  • Since lovehorses mentioned Dr. Fager, I am reminded to add Aspidistra to my broodmare band.
  • carolinarkansascarolinarkansas hot springs, arkansasMember
    Since lovehorses mentioned Dr. Fager, I am reminded to add Aspidistra to my broodmare band.
    Could add the doctors full sister....Ta Wee...
  • carolinarkansascarolinarkansas hot springs, arkansasMember
    And an iron lady of old who mostly ran against the boys....and carried more weight...the great Gallorette
  • carolinarkansascarolinarkansas hot springs, arkansasMember
    If you guys get me started on the ladies.....oh well ....here's a few more...
    Shuvee.....Susan's Girl.....Chris Evert...Imp....
  • edited February 2014
    Since lovehorses mentioned Dr. Fager, I am reminded to add Aspidistra to my broodmare band.

    Could add the doctors full sister....Ta Wee...
    Half sister, but yes, definitely add her to the broodmare band. (Ta Wee was by Intentionally; the good Doctor by Rough N' Tumble.)

    On the subject of dams and siblings, how about Sweet Life, Sweet Catomine, and Life is Sweet? They'd make a nice broodmare band all on their own.

    There's also the terribly misnamed No Class, dam of three champions and granddam of Smart Strike.
  • Calimonco is the full brother to all those mares; life is Sweet, Sweet Catomine, and Sweet Life.
  • He's Sweet Life's son and full brother to the other two.
  • I would LOVE to see the Kitten's Joy/Big Brown cross.
  • RachelRachel Member
    edited February 2014
    Wasnt supposed to go here
Sign In or Register to comment.