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America's Joy (American Pharoah x Leslie's Lady)

Especially_HorsesEspecially_Horses Member
in Active & Retired Thoroughbreds
Record-Priced Keeneland Filly Named America's Joy
American Pharoah filly likely to make racing debut in late summer 2020.

https://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/articles/237535/record-priced-keeneland-filly-named-americas-joy

Comments

  • QueenZFan22QueenZFan22 Member
    From Brisnet:

    AMERICA’S JOY: The $8.2 million Keeneland September topper is first on the list alphabetically, and first in order of interest as the half-sister to four-time Eclipse Award champion Beholder, Mendelssohn, and leading sire Into Mischief. Mandy Pope’s Whisper Hill Farm purchased the April 25-foaled daughter of Broodmare of the Year Leslie’s Lady.
  • QueenZFan22QueenZFan22 Member
    Here is her equibase page: http://www.equibase.com/profiles/Results.cfm?type=Horse&refno=10447026&registry=T
  • Especially_HorsesEspecially_Horses Member
    Kind of wonder why Mandy didn't go with American Joy. I like it just a wee bit better.
  • QueenZFan22QueenZFan22 Member
    'She's perfect'; $8.2 million filly America's Joy in training: https://horseracingnation.com/news/Mandy_Pope_on_her_8_2_million_filly_Americas_Joy_and_more_123?fbclid=IwAR1IpPZHEQbYaWjgNNx5SURxXX_ievRh9sMQ0kbuJy1w4wQNhKlsJ6pXbbE
  • JulkyJulky Member
    The article says last foal? Wasn’t see bred again after that?
  • Especially_HorsesEspecially_Horses Member
    edited April 2020
    The error was pointed out to the author and he has corrected.

    After delivering this filly, she had a 2019 Not This Time filly and then bred in 2019 to Kantharos and is carrying another filly for 2020. Both of the last two foals will reportedly be retained by the family.

    Does anyone have any thoughts on why they would have gone to Kantharos?
    Julky said:

    The article says last foal? Wasn’t see bred again after that?

  • KMMKMM Member
    Look at TDN article. Taking Stock:The Mare Nick.

    Kantharos is a Storm Cat line sire, which has been a very successful match for Leslie’s a Lady.
  • Especially_HorsesEspecially_Horses Member
    But why particularly Kantharos? The stats below aren't that great to me. He's just not a stallion that would have come to my mind when researching a mate for her, especially knowing it was going to be her last breeding. I'm just curious and it would be interesting to learn about their thought process in selecting him.

    image
    KMM said:

    Look at TDN article. Taking Stock:The Mare Nick.

    Kantharos is a Storm Cat line sire, which has been a very successful match for Leslie’s a Lady.

  • jaefeatheredjaefeathered Member
    edited April 2020
    Kantharos is absolutely an up and coming stallion. He has an AEI of, 1.55 compared to a CI of 1.28 (meaning that he moves his mares way up on average), and a very strong 6.3% SWs to progeny of racing age (not counting the current 2yo crop, since it's way early in the year).

    You can't take TrueNicks as gospel, because it simply doesn't count the dam side of the equation, along with a thousand other things. Leslie's Lady has proven time and again that she loves the Storm Cat line, so it makes complete sense to go to a stallion like Kantharos.
  • Especially_HorsesEspecially_Horses Member
    edited April 2020
    Storm Cat line....absolutely. Rely 100% on True Nicks...absolutely not. But stats should have some weight and there have been no stakes winners produced from that specific cross. I can think of at least three other Storm Cat line stallions that intrigue me....First Samurai, Stormy Atlantic, Tale of the Cat. Obviously this is all just "lock down" hypothetical fun. I have nothing against Kantharos as a stallion, was only looking at him in terms of "last stallion/ mate for Leslie's Lady."
    jaefeathered said:

    Kantharos is absolutely an up and coming stallion. He has an AEI of, 1.55 compared to a CI of 1.28 (meaning that he moves his mares way up on average), and a very strong 6.3% SWs to progeny of racing age (not counting the current 2yo crop, since it's way early in the year).

    You can't take TrueNicks as gospel, because it simply doesn't count the dam side of the equation, along with a thousand other things. Leslie's Lady has proven time and again that she loves the Storm Cat line, so it makes complete sense to go to a stallion like Kantharos.

  • jaefeatheredjaefeathered Member
    edited April 2020
    Statistics do have weight. If you check G1 Goldmine, there are a number of excellent horses bred on this pattern. Recognize a couple of the names?

    Name G1 G2 G3 E CSI
    INTO MISCHIEF 1 0 0 31 18
    NAVAL OFFICER 0 0 1 0 18
    BEHOLDER 11 0 2 31 15
    LION HEART 2 0 2 0 15
    AZUL LEON 0 1 1 0 15
    MENDELSSOHN 1 0 0 34 14
  • Especially_HorsesEspecially_Horses Member
    Awesome names. :) And those names pop up for First Samurai and Tale of the Cat when assessing top foals bred on a specific cross, but not for Kantharos and Stormy Atlantic. There are divisions within divisions of the Storm Cat line. Going to a Storm Cat line stallion for her last foal was a no-brainer.
    jaefeathered said:

    Statistics do have weight. If you check G1 Goldmine, there are a number of excellent horses bred on this cross. Recognize a couple of the names?

    Name G1 G2 G3 E CSI
    INTO MISCHIEF 1 0 0 31 18
    NAVAL OFFICER 0 0 1 0 18
    BEHOLDER 11 0 2 31 15
    LION HEART 2 0 2 0 15
    AZUL LEON 0 1 1 0 15
    MENDELSSOHN 1 0 0 34 14

  • jaefeatheredjaefeathered Member
    There are plenty of reasons not to go to any particular stallion.

    First Samurai has an AEI/CI of 1.43/1.77, which isn't exactly a glowing stat. He also has a much lower ratio of SWs to foal at around 4%.

    Tale of the Cat currently has an AEI/CI of 1.36/1.59, and a SW% of about 4.5%.

    Stormy Atlantic has strong stats (and I'm a huge fan of his, so don't get me wrong), but he's not the best looking horse and is getting up there in years.

    Again, Kantharos was a really solid choice for them. I'm not at all surprised that they sent Leslie's Lady to him.
  • Especially_HorsesEspecially_Horses Member
    edited April 2020
    You get an A+ You convinced me, I'm on board!

    :)
    jaefeathered said:

    There are plenty of reasons not to go to any particular stallion.

    First Samurai has an AEI/CI of 1.43/1.77, which isn't exactly a glowing stat. He also has a much lower ratio of SWs to foal at around 4%.

    Tale of the Cat currently has an AEI/CI of 1.36/1.59, and a SW% of about 4.5%.

    Stormy Atlantic has strong stats (and I'm a huge fan of his, so don't get me wrong), but he's not the best looking horse and is getting up there in years.

    Again, Kantharos was a really solid choice for them. I'm not at all surprised that they sent Leslie's Lady to him.

  • Especially_HorsesEspecially_Horses Member
    So Marr Time, the Not This Time filly, was foaled on May 6, 2019, so some time to go before LL foals. Oh man, I'm really praying for a safe and healthy mare and foal. I want a happy ending please. Does Leslie's Lady have her own Thread?
  • QueenZFan22QueenZFan22 Member
    UPDATE: She still hasn't worked yet.
  • QueenZFan22QueenZFan22 Member
    Still no workouts yet.
  • QueenZFan22QueenZFan22 Member
    She is having workouts! Here is her latest one: Whisper Hill Training Center 3/6/2021 Dirt 4F 51.80 Breezing 3/3
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