Game On Dude...HOY??

raceonraceon Member
Who thinks that Game On Dude should be HOY if he enters the Breeder's Cup Classic and finishes in the top three? He is 5 for 5 this year with three Grade l's and two Grade ll's. I would love to see this gelding get the respect that he deserves.


  • If Wise Dan or Royal Delta get into the Classic, then it's winner take all. But if WD and RD don't, then G.O.D may wrap it up as you say.
  • I agree I think he's deserved it.
  • You gotta give it to him, he earned it! But if Wise Dan or Royal Delta challenge him for it, all bets are off!
  • kurtkurt Member
    if the season ended today, Dude is hoy. other then wise dan, everyone else has been up and down this season and im not sure the voters are going to give hoy to a grass horse again this year. i think mark is about right, short of a terrible run in the bcc, dudes got this one
  • Okay, does this mean another hike in Awesome Again's stud fee........hmmmmm! ;)
  • If GOD wins the BC Classic, he's HOY. My guess is WD is next in line if he finishes season unbeaten. If GOD and WD faulter and RD wins out, she'll be HOY. So many variables.
  • I hope The Dude enters the BCC and takes it the way he won on Sunday. Sweet vindication. Interesting to speculate on who the jock will be. I think RD will be aimed to the Distaff; her third straight victory; that's a gimme for her.
  • I agree, he's earned it as well as Martin Garcia! Just wish it wasn't Baff-fert training him! Just watch and see if 'pretty boy' doesn't take him away from Martin, that's why he was hiding out in the clockers shed, he didn't believe Martin could bring it home! Any other time, you would hear him bragging all over the place!
  • Yeah, good point!
  • Martin is a good jock, he's too aligned with Baffert though
  • edited August 2013
    yeah, but he's starting to branch out. He's realizing he doesn't owe Baff-fert his loyalty anymore, He exercised and trained all of Baff-fert's winners and to constantly be kicked to the curb, anyone can only take so much! He has his green card now, so Bob can't hold that over his head. Majority of the maiden wins for Baffert were won by Martin, when he went back to Mexico to get his paperwork straighten out and had to sit out a suspension for being late with it, Baff-fert left him out in the cold. Martin used to be his first call jockey, then Bejarano; not the other way around. But now Sadler, Belvoir, and Mike Mitchell are starting to give him mounts, watch and see if Mr. Baff-fert don't throw him a bone or two to try to keep him in line. If anyone knows where the 'bones are buried' it's Martin Garcia and if he ever gets enough courage in himself, I betcha he can tear down Bob Baffert's house!
  • markinsacmarkinsac Member
    edited August 2013
    Valeria! Wow, nice post! You brought up an interesting insight, the relationship between the trainers and the jockeys. And since most jocks have to hustle to get decent mounts, the trainers have the upper hand. Plus most jocks are from Mexico, Central and South America, the trainers have a bit of control, especially the younger ones.

    But if you got the talent, nobody tells you what to do. Rosario, Dominguez, Bejarano, just to name a few. Garcia actually didn't get on a horse until his late teens. But it was a natural fit.

    I applaud those brave jocks who risk their limbs every 30 minutes. And I hope more of them stand up to trainers' shenanigans. After all, the trainer sits in the luxury box during the race, hoodwinking the owner! . . . While the jock is out there doing the hard work.
  • markinsacmarkinsac Member
    edited August 2013
    I'm going to tell you why I say trainers take owners to the bank . . . and it isn't always the case. But from my experiences as a groom, mostly in the harness industry and a short while for the thoroughbreds, I've seen trainers come over and brag to my boss about how much they ripped off their owner.

    Back in the day when harness was big in California, trainers used to talk owners into buying horses from Australia and New Zealand. If the horses actual purchase price was $20,000, the trainer would tell the owner the price was $35,000. Then the trainer and the seller from down under would split up the extra proceeds. The trainer could also charge the owner for extra feed and vet bills, almost as much as he or she wanted to.

    Most owners had excess money, so it wasn't a problem in most cases. The trainer I worked for was honest and had to be because our primary owner was a lawyer and you couldn't even try to pull a fast one on him. But I have a lot of empathy for the owners. Usually they are generous people who are in it for the thrill, hoping to make a buck too. Most owners, however, lose money in the game, just like the bettors. A slick trainer always makes money.

    When me, the groom, the trainer, the jockey, the owner and the horse are standing in the winners' circle, it's an unbelievably awesome feeling, a feeling of accomplishment.

    There were and are many shady deals going on in the backstretch where used car salesmen and women do their best to come out on top. So, with this kind of mentality, it's not hard to fathom the cheating. If you're going to cheat an owner, why not try to cheat a race?

    PS, that comment was based on my experiences. I'm not suggesting that EVERY trainer uses these tactics. But there are some cases of trainers getting sued by owners for fraud. And it usually happens in soCal.

    PS2, without a doubt, those in the horse racing industry backstretch work hard. Sometimes you NEVER take a day off! After all, the horses have to be fed several times a day. The reason I didn't last long with the thoroughbreds is they get started so damn early in the morning. Remember, harness raced at night, so sometimes I could be in the test barn until 1 am., go to sleep at 2. If that was the case, I might not get started the next day until 8am. But the thoroughbreds race in the day, so you had to start early, like at 5am. I was younger then and couldn't adjust.

    PS3, One more crazy thought: You see people in the backstretch who spend their ENTIRE careers grooming or training horses. Usually their parents were in the business and they started out cleaning stalls as kids. Some of these people don't know what a vacation is, or what a movie theatre is. Some hardly ever leave the backstretch area.
  • edited August 2013
    Yeah, I started noticing Martin when I first got into watching Zenyatta and the rest of John's stable. In early 09 he was just a bug boy, but he could ride his butt off! When he lost his bug boy status, he was to present his green card in order to receive his jockey status, but Baff-fert had him riding just about every day, and he didn't have time to go back to Mexico and get it before his expiration ran out. So when Santa Anita suspended him and gave him thirty days to get his card in order (he was riding First Dude, Game on Dude, Richard's Kid, and Paynter, as well as being first call), he had chosen to ride First Dude over Game on Dude; Baff-fert gave all his mounts to Bejarano and Chantal (during that time Bejarano was riding for whoever wanted him and Chantal was backup to Mike for the Mosses and the Wysgods (Garrett was first call until he was injured). She also rode for John Sadler and Mike Mitchell (first call). When Martin got all his paperwork straighten out and had served his suspension, Baff-fert refused to give him his mounts back, but used him as a glorified exercise rider. The media pundits made fun of it, saying he must of pissed Bob off, to loose his mounts. When Bejarano lost to Awesome Gem on Game on Dude, he yanked him off and put up Chantal, when Chantal lost on the Dude, he yanked her and put Rosario on him. Joel decided to move back east to be closer to family and his agent, that's how Mikey got the mount! After Zenyatta, retired Mikey decided he wanted to be able to ride fewer and more selective races and not be limited to the west coast. He was Ebby's primary exercise rider but Mr. Kronfield wanted him as first call but Mike couldn't promise him that because of obligations to Bodemeister, and Royal Delta, so in came Corey (we all were surprised to see Corey get the mount on Ebby, because Jacklyn and Mike were her primary riders). Look back at her breezes and morning workouts, it's Mike or Jacklyn up. Anyway, back to Martin and Baff-fert, when derby season came around and all the first call jocks were gone back east, Sadler, Mitchell, Mandella and Belvoir started giving Martin good mounts to ride and he starting winning against Baff-fert's horses, here come Bob throwing him a bone here, a bone there. But Martin has always been his primary exercise rider, and I guarantee you, that he knows what's going on in that stable, he just needs agent that while stand up for him and broaden his horizons. He needs a Laffitt Pincay or Angel Cordero, because I can promise you that Joe Torre made him put Martin on the Dude! Baff-fert is well known for being a petty and vengeful lowlife. If that's not enough drama for you, we can always talk about the saga of Richard's Kid! (lol)
  • markinsacmarkinsac Member
    edited August 2013
    A California soap opera, I'm seeing the word "dude" a lot. Out here in Cali, guys call their girlfriends and wives "dude" too. I think we use the "dude" word on her when she's acting ridiculous, you know, like a "dude."
  • I liked it when you used the word "petty" in the same sentence as "Baff-fert." How accurate!
  • edited August 2013
    Well it's the truth, he is petty! Who else takes up all the stall spaces, even if he doesn't need them all. Who else cries foul, when they're in the wrong! You'd think that after his heart attack, he'd mellow out but all he did was become more subtle in his tactics. Who else need their wife to defend them from the press? And I truly believe he set up Doug O'neil and Carla Gaines, I'm not saying Doug was lily white but after Richard's Kid aka Ricardo was abruptly moved to Doug's barn by his owners,and IHA became competitive against LAL and Bodemeister, CHRB decided to pronounce a suspension on a violation that was almost two years old, in the middle of derby season! But what Baff-fert didn't count on was that Leandro Mora is the backbone of O'neil racing stable, and while Doug was at home playing with the kids, Leandro was eating Bob for lunch! The 'dude looks like a lady'! And what Leandro didn't do to him, Sadler, Mandella and Hollendorfer did!
  • markinsacmarkinsac Member
    edited August 2013
    Valeria, for being from Illinois, you sure know what's going on in the backside in soCal! And the backside in soCal isn't Polytrack, it's DIRT!

    O'Neil isn't an angel, but he was set up as a scapegoat! The CHRB can claim: "SEE, WE GO AFTER CHEATERS!"

    I'd like to see the CHRB suspend one trainer who trains a horse for one of the board members. If this has happened, please let me know.

    PS, I didn't like Carla Gaines using the "bakery products" excuse. Remember in the year 2000, Baff-fert told one of his grooms to lie to investigators about eating bakery products around a dirty horse. Baff-fert didn't get punished, either.

    I mean lying to investigators is like lying under oath, isn't it?
  • I agree, he's earned it as well as Martin Garcia! Just wish it wasn't Baff-fert training him! Just watch and see if 'pretty boy' doesn't take him away from Martin, that's why he was hiding out in the clockers shed, he didn't believe Martin could bring it home! Any other time, you would hear him bragging all over the place!
    Would you object if Mike Smith were given the mount on GoD? After all, he has had lots of success on the Dude. I like Martin Garcia, but has he earned the right to keep GoD over Mike? We don't know what arrangement Baffert made with the jockeys. It may be that Garcia rode with the understanding that he was a substitute--we just don't know. Plus, Mike Smith has had some success winning the Breeders' Cup Classic. If I'm Baffert and Smith is available to ride GoD in the Classic, Smith gets the mount.
  • edited August 2013
    Not gonna happen, why you think Mr. Moss quit the board? Why do you think when the Mosses want to release a press release, they call up their dear friend Joe Drape at the New York Times! Everything I've learned is from old school players on various racings blogs, various trainers (some not afraid to speak out, some will remain anonymous), reading and researching the history of horseracing. Oneil did a tv interview about what was going on during his 'vacation', and although he didn't come out and say certain things; you could read between the lines and know what he was saying. When TVG did a special on drugs in horseracing, they had many top trainers at their roundtable discussing the pros/cons of using illicit drugs, some trainers/owners had no fear of speaking out against it; even had grooms and trainers speaking in anonymity for fear of retaliation. They had top equine vets, animal physiololgists, pharmacologists, and ex-jockeys who were not afraid to speak up and tell some very ugly stories they witnessed on the backside, to even include security guards giving meds/milkshakes to horses or having outsiders come in and do it for them; so when they're asked about it they can say they didn't do it and not be caught in a lie! And this is not just in 'Disney World' but all over, some places worse than others! What I don't understand tho, is how can you be racing horses and allowed to sit on the racing commission, isn't this a conflict of interest?
  • markinsacmarkinsac Member
    edited August 2013
    Valeria, can you post the link to that TVG special on drugs in racing?

    Second, YES, IT'S A CONFLICT OF INTEREST. But we have to be fair here, Mr. Moss shouldn't have been on the board either, as much as I appreciate what he did for the sport.

    Or at least this: Board members should abstain from voicing any opinion if it involves an issue with their horses. In a way, it's good that board members have SOME experience in the business.

    The only people in the business who aren't represented are the bettors!

    Good info, Valeria
  • edited August 2013
    Mark, here you go:

  • markinsacmarkinsac Member
    edited August 2013
    thanks, before I continue, I just clicked tried to get into the paulick report and upped popped a TVG ad with a young ballerina and her dad taking a picture of her on his cell phone. But dad was actually watching the races!

    How ASSININE of TVG to insinuate the horses are more important than your kids!
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