Horse Photographers and Photographs
SallyT
Member
This is a new thread created to discuss and share your favorite websites for horse photographers, and photographs. Since we need to be aware of copyrights, and abide by site rules and legal issues, photographic images should not be posted unless that are taken by you, OR are public domain, OR with permission from the photographer and credit given to them. If you need information about how to post, see the "Posting Images – Rules & Guidelines" thread at the top of the forum.
I will start by listing Barbara Livingston's twitter account. She just won her third Eclipse award for photography. She posts photos frequently, and you can sign up to follow her if you would like.
https://twitter.com/DRFLivingston/media
I will start by listing Barbara Livingston's twitter account. She just won her third Eclipse award for photography. She posts photos frequently, and you can sign up to follow her if you would like.
https://twitter.com/DRFLivingston/media
Comments
Anne M. Eberhardt is a photographer who is listed there- I've notched her work quite often.
An example of copyright infringement is taking someone else's photo and selling it as your own to a calendar company or publication such as a magazine or newspaper.
Sharing a link to a forum or your facebook page isn't harming the photographer and is actually providing exposure to others who wouldn't otherwise know of that photographer. I think no one can see the content on a facebook page that is not posted for the public unless they have been friended by the page owner. Also in the Z Forum I think it's okay because you have to be a member of the Forum to see all the content (? or not? not sure) at least you have to know which thread to look in. To me it's the same as showing someone a picture, possibly on the photographer's own website to a friend on your screen, on your computer. If it's in your own home, there's no problem at all. But maybe you show it to your friend on your laptop or ipad and someone sitting next to you on the bus can see it also. That person wasn't deliberately shown the photo, but they got to see it. Yet no one insists that people sharing pictures on their iphone, or whatever, hold the iphone so that only the intended person can see it. That would be ridiculous in my opinion. To me, posting the picture on your own facebook page is kind of the same thing. That way you can show a friend what so-and-so or such-and-such looks like, the same way you would if the friend were sitting next to you looking at your screen, only the friend lives 3,000 miles away. Sharing on the Forum, giving full credit to the photographer is just sharing with a few more friends. It's saying, "Hey check out this horse. Isn't s/he beautiful, cute, wonderful, whatever? Does that make sense?
It makes sense to me. I think about it in terms of research projects and presentations in high school and college. Plagiarism is claiming someone else's ideas or work as your own. Teachers and professors require that you cite your sources and give them credit, but they don't require you to hunt down the authors/photographers to ask their permission. As long as people are not claiming ownership of or making money from photos they don't own, I see no issue.
Here is why sharing a photo that is COPYRIGHTED on a public website or forum without permission is not OK with me.
I shared some of my photographs here on the forum. Yes I want you to look at them, please enjoy them, go ahead and use one as a desktop if you want, show it to a friend. But do not post my COPYRIGHTED image to a public website without my direct permission. I may or may not give it-depending on the photo.
Posting a COPYRIGHTED image that you did not take, or get permission to use, on a public website is wrong no matter how you slice it. (legally or ethically). I chose not to share my photos with the universe. I did NOT post any of my images on Facebook (or anyplace else) -but someone else did. Now anyone can use it, however they want to-I no longer have control over my image.
Buddy said "As long as people are not claiming ownership of or making money from photos they don't own, I see no issue." Please try to understand that the issue is that by using or posting a COPYRIGHTED image that does not belong to you, and has not been made public, to a public place-you have in effect, given it to other people-which is not your right. You have "given away" someone else's property, so they could very well lose money. It's not just about you, "not" making money. Apparently on the ink/ instagram photo of mine that was posted by whomever, when you hover over the photo, it gives photo credit to the poster, not me. Am I OK with that? NOPE.
The internet has provided limitless opportunities for people to "take" whatever they want (images, music, movies). Why do we need to pay for these things? In the grander scheme of things; Because if the owner of a song, for example, doesn't get any reimbursement for their work it impacts their bottom line. No compensation = no career = no new music. Try to empathize with young musicians trying to break into the business, in order to get some momentum going, not a Taylor Swift superstar, although it applies to everyone. That's why ASCAP began collecting fees.
For the "little guy" photographer; Some people have spent a lot of time learning their craft, and actually taking their photographs. Not to mention a lot of money on equipment to get their images. If they want to give their images away, by all means, that's their decision. But if a photographer places a watermark or copyright on their images, that is also their choice to NOT give the images away. The internet has complicated the issue a million-fold.
Why does this matter?
For me personally, I want to retain ownership of my own photographs for several reasons;
1) I am not a "professional". But a professional is simply someone who has received compensation for their photograph. While I do not currently have any for sale, it is a distinct possibility in the future. If my photo is already out in the public domain, businesses or individuals will not, or are not likely to purchase them.
2) As an artist and a teacher, images are very important to me as resources. If I want a reference photograph for a painting/drawing, It is not legal for me to copy (use as a direct reference) a COPYRIGHTED published photograph. As an example-the National Duck Stamp folks run a contest every year with very clearly stated rules. You are NOT permitted to even submit any artwork that uses a photograph, that is not yours to use, of the bird as a reference. (Think of books such as Audubon Filed Guides ) Why? Because they don't want to wind up being sued.
3) I have been taking photographs for over 40 years and have compiled files of thousands of my photographs to use as LEGAL references for my work. Many years ago (before the internet) I took numerous photos of a bear & her cubs. A wildlife artist saw them, and wanted to purchase the photos as resources for her work. She was the individual who explained to me about COPYRIGHT laws and photographs at that time. She told me the story of her friend, who was taken to court because a photographer or publisher of a (calendar? or something) claimed her friend's painting of a deer was a direct copy of a photograph of a deer that they had published.
4) Publishing has changed drastically in the last 20 years. I am in the process of submitting several of my (COPYRIGHTED) photographs, that were NOT published publicly by me, for publication. If I were fortunate enough to be considered for acceptance/publication, and someone had stolen my images, you can bet your bottom dollar I'll be going after them through the courts.
5) Many folks on this forum have appreciated the photos I've posted, so I hate to say it, but I will refrain from posting my COPYRIGHTED images here until further notice. I was thinking that perhaps I could figure something out that would enable people to enjoy them, without using them for other purposes. I'll let you know if I find a resolution to the quandry. I have seen some people complain about other photographers placing huge watermarks across their images-now folks will hopefully understand why. There are also protections that you can imbed in a photograph to prevent downloading-and conversely, software that overrides those protections. People can crop smaller copyrights out, or otherwise use editing tools to cover watermarks. I enjoyed sharing images with people who appreciate them. But will not if I am undermined by those who feel they have "rights" above mine.
VA in CA said
Sharing a link to a forum or your facebook page isn't harming the photographer and is actually providing exposure to others who wouldn't otherwise know of that photographer. I think no one can see the content on a facebook page that is not posted for the public unless they have been friended by the page owner.
I respectfully disagree, VA in CA. Some artists may feel that way, and If they wanted to share THEIR OWN work publicly they may certainly choose to post it publicly. If they do not choose to do that, no one should take it upon themselves to make that decision for the artist. That's why asking permission is a simple means to address the issue if there are any questions of ownership. Although I do not have direct experience with "friending", I am under the impression that it does not indicate in any way that the "friend" is even a known entity.
Lastly, I have tried to err on the side of caution. I have learned a lot through this process, and discussion, but I still have plenty more to learn. I have made some mistakes. I've been using a computer and the internet for 20 years. When I finally decided in August of 2014 to share images, I did it in the most conservative manner that I could determine. I only posted photos from a private (locked) instagram folder. It recalled for me a conversation that I had with an extremely talented high school student doing an "independent study" with me back in the mid 1990's. We (a charter group of artist-mentors, art teachers and the state) had created a mentoring website where students could post & receive constructive feedback on their works in progress. (it was quite revolutionary at the time-LOL) "Tim" refused to post images on this secure, password protected site, because he was concerned someone might steal his work. (He is now an engineer).
http://thoroughbredjourney.com
A couple more nice website of racehorse photos
http://bobcoglianesephotos.photoshelter.com
http://equinephoto-art.com/2014 thoroughbred greats.html
http://www.horseracingphotographer.com/galleries/
http://www.equisportphotos.com/Horse-Racing
http://equinephotography.com (artsy)
international;
http://www.racehorsephotos.co.uk/gallery.html
http://racehorsephotoimages.com
http://www.nicomorgan.com/?search=racehorse+photography
http://thoroughbredphoto.com/index.asp
You have always been kind, appreciative and respectful of the photos that I and others have posted here. It's for people like you that I would like to figure out a "safe" way to continue to share my images, if it exists.
The fact is, my photos are my photos, they are copyrighted by me. If I choose to post them somewhere on Facebook, Twitter, Instagram, what have you, that doesn't give anyone the right to share them. Even on Facebook, if I see a photo I like, I ask the person if I can share it, (Usually, Barbara Livingston's work), and 99% of the time, permission is granted. I look at it as common courtesy. After receiving permission, I not only post credit to the photographer, but add in "used with permission". That way, no one can hint that it's a copyright infringement, the photographer is getting full credit, and they know I am sharing it with other fans.
I think when you ask, if you plan to put it on more than one site, you should stress that as well. YOU may not edit out a copyright, but that doesn't mean someone you don't know, won't. For example, if I ask Barbara if I can share her photo on Facebook, and she says yes, that doesn't mean I can share it on Twitter, or Instagram or Pinterest.
Be courteous, ask permission, and then post the photos with credit and that tag line of Used with permission.
Thanks Casey, I was hoping you would approve of my explanation. In our world of constant use of social media, people don't always understand the implications of what has become an all too common practice. I knew my post would be long, with examples needed to (hopefully effectively) explain the "whys" of the issue.
That's one of the reasons I wanted to get this topic off of Coz's thread. People would see all the new posts and go there to read, thinking he was racing (!) and instead find this discussion interspersed in bits and pieces.
However, this discussion topic does make me think of another question for the professionals on here. Our OTTB was not a talented race horse, but we did find one of his Win photos on the web so of course, we wanted a copy. It was clearly marked so we contacted the photographer and purchased a nice photo from them which I am thrilled to have. If I wanted to share it to my Facebook page, and I took a picture of a portion of that photo with my phone camera and shared the image that I just took, wouldn't that be copyright infringement also or something else because I'm sharing the image that I took?
I think the safest thing to do is contact the photographer you bought the photograph from, and ask for permission to use it on Facebook. A couple of years ago I bought a beautiful copyrighted photograph of Ebblouissante. The copyright explanation from that purchase was very explicit that it could not be used for any purpose (other than simply enjoying it) without permission. I had purchased a photographic print, not the rights to it. I haven't shared it on this forum (or anywhere else) because It's not mine to share, nor have I asked permission to. It's a beautiful black and white head shot of her exercising by Moran Photography.
I enjoy photographing my nephew's hockey games whenever I can. A few years ago I saw a great photo of him in both a printed newspaper, (as well as the online edition) with the photographers name in the credit. I Googled the photographer, and sure enough, he had a website! (Frank Wojciechowski) I contacted him, and not only was I able to purchase that specific photo, but he sent me the whole series of the photo sequence on CD, (for no additional charge) along with a couple of others he had taken that day! You never know until you ask! (I framed three photos from the sequence in a triple matted frame & gave it to my nephew for Christmas that year.)
http://www.chronofhorse.com/article/horse-show-photographers-are-facing-crisis
As more people find their way to the internet with all the photos in abundance, it certainly is a risk for someone to enter the field of equine photography. I find it all rather sad. @ SallyT, I think your suggestion of contacting the photographer again is what would work best, at least for my conscience, if I do decide I must post that photo of his win. I certainly already flood my Facebook and Instagram with my choppy pics I take of him with the phone camera - lol!
http://cameras.reviewed.com/features/stop-giving-away-your-photos?utm_source=spikes&utm_medium=referral&utm_campaign=collab
I read many image hosting website policies, before selecting
Image Shack, as I had been forewarned about some of them. I stayed away from many sites because they essentially could do anything they wanted with "your" photos. The instagram quote is revealing. (I don't Instagram or Facebook, so have never selected the options pointed out.)